this is cleo
i rescued her from awful conditions early this year
i thought she was a hermann's but i'm now thinking she is a cross-breed?
any thoughts on this please
here are some pics i took when i got her, must get some recent ones

here she is with Thursday, another rescue

you can see the hole here where she was tethered!

and her 1st time EVER on grass/soil

and in the bath

i meant to say that Thursday is knocking on 100 and Cleo is just 5 years old

i must admit she is very dark.i understand that hermanni hermanni have solid bands of black down either side of the plastron.i dont have any hands on experience with them so cant say for certain.you should see Dawns hermans tort named bentley now thats a dark hermans.perhaps (ozric)Jonathon will be on later he has a real interest in the hermanni hermanni so might be able to enlighen us.Thursday looks a special old lady.

Thursday is very special yes she belonged to an elderly couple and lived and hibernated happily in their garden, she pretty much fended for herself until the old man died and the old lady went into a nursing home, the damage is caused by a lawn mower, a pure accident, the old man didn't know she was there, she's absolutely fine
Thursday is the old lady i was tellin you about Terry, the 1 that was acting gravid, she's calmed right down now i'm thinking she was havin "a hormone moment" she scared me half to death i did not want her to have eggs at her age, i feared problems
with Cleo i was thinkin on the lines of marginated?

from what i can see she has a tail spur and the plastral markings what i can see of them resemble hermans.

I am so jealous of you having a tort that is such an old age.... she is very special and I'm sure she's getting all the attention she truely deserves xxxx

Cleo looks like a hermans to me, as Terry said I've got one that is quite dark, but some of mine are also quite 'yellow' in fact the only one's that look simular are the related ones - my older girls, the others are all different from one another!

Wow!!! Sue I have forgotten how lovely Thursday is and Cleo doesn't look so big in those pics.

wow they are both beautiful,I love Thursday

I would say no to marginated - simply because my boys are almost 5 yrs old and their 'skirts' are beautiful and obvious, can see where you are coming from re the markings, but they are also darker than my boys. x

its the plastral markings that confirm it is a hermans but cant be sure of sub species from these pictures.marginata normally have very distinctive plastral markings.